Would you date an atheist?

English: Humanist Logo (Photo credit: Wikipedia)

What happens when two people meet, sparks fly and there’s no turning back. The love bug has bitten and things are about to get serious. Then you find out that one of you is believer and the other is not.

Most people will have this chat pretty early on, many know right from the outset, and yet it does not seem to deter those jumping head first into committed relationships. In those exciting early days I can understand how it might not seem like a big deal. We can work through anything. We love each other and we’ll figure it out as we go along.

Now, I’m not talking about people who come happen to come from a religious background. Those who tick the religion box on the census form but then carry on living their lives however they like (Good for them, I say, but there is usually a ‘prefer not to say’ box if you keep reading). In my old church days these were the Christingle Christians I only ever met once a year, by candlelight, with a lot of fruit and sugar. Generally a nice, fun-loving bunch of people.

I can see how, if religious belief is something a couple both have little interest in, a bit of compromise can overcome most issues. But what about a person completely devoted to their faith and God falling for a person who is a passionate secular humanist, devoted to avoiding prayer with a bargepole. Can this ever really work long term?

Here are the reasons why I don’t think it would work for me as an atheist:

• Marriage (and long-term commitments) – For me this means we are going on a journey through life together. I don’t have to agree with my partner on everything, but the fundamentals about what is important in life, what life means, affects the choices we make as a couple.
• Kids – Raising little people is bloody hard enough as it is without having this extra issue to deal with. Do you take them to church but tell them they can believe what they like? Do you teach the religious scripture as fact or do you constantly remind them it’s all just a theory that their parents don’t agree on? It all just seems pretty complicated to me.
• .The Arguments – Anyone in a healthy relationship knows that the occasional row heated debate can keep things fresh, as can making up afterwards. But on an issue this big? You can compromise on behaviour, but you can’t change what you fundamentally believe in. It seems to me common ground is going to be limited and why would anyone want to compromise on something like this in the comfort of their own home?
• The Afterlife – When I snuggle up in bed at night, I don’t know how comfortable I’d feel if I thought that person lying next to me, in a roundabout way, if you reaaalllly pushed them on it, thinks I’m going to burn in hell. And how could they feel like I respect them if ultimately they know that I think their beliefs are a load of old codswallop?

I write about Christianity here because it’s the one I know the best. I live in a Christian country don’t you know (and don’t I know). But I so want to know more from anyone out there who has any real experience of this. Atheists and believers. Sikhs and Hindus. Muslims and Christians. Anyone who has a story about how religion affected your relationship with the person that you love. Please share your stories with me, your thoughts, successes and failures. Thanks.

The Ten Humanist Commandments

1. Try to be a good person. Not to avoid burning in eternal hell. Just because it makes life better for everyone.
2. Form your own beliefs based on evidence, fact and reason.
3. If you screw up big time, don’t be afraid to apologise and try to make amends. Preferably with the person it concerns, rather than going over their head to God.
4. Admit it when you find out you were wrong in your beliefs. It’s OK to change your mind if new evidence springs to light.
5. Try to enjoy life as much as possible and let others do the same.
6. If you see bad things happening, do what is in your power to try to bring about change.
7. Care about the society in which you live and what is done in your name.
8. Respect and value diversity. Let people do what they like in their private lives, so long as it doesn’t take away the rights of others.
9. Thou shalt not murder. I’m pretty cool with this excerpt from the original. Remember that you can disagree with people on a lot of things, but you can usually find something in common if you keep the conversation flowing.
10. Add your own rule for life. You have a conscience, don’t be afraid to use it and do good. Chances are if you are following rules 1-9 you’re a pretty decent human being and most likely a humanist at heart.

What religion is your 3-year-old?

My eldest son just turned three and the time came to find a nursery. The closest one that is not attached to a church or a church school is a 40 minute walk away, but at least I found one I’m really happy with. It’s all learning through fun, with lots of outdoor play and no letter from your local priest required to gain entry. So why is it that in the standard paperwork they ask what religion my child is?

And if there are any other religions festivals he celebrates? And any religious dietry requirements? And anything else I’d like to mention about his religious needs? Half a page of A4 for me to ensure that the staff are fully equipped to deal with my tot’s complex, spiritual and individual needs

The EYFS (compulsory guidelines for all UK early years care providers) requires that all nurseries must respect the Equality Act 2010.

All sounds great? Equality for the kids too yeah?

All workers in this sector have to show that they respect every child’s religion. It’s not enough just to be a decent, tolerant person and not discriminate against preschoolers. You have to show now that you are allowing the child to express their religious identity and encourage their cultural practices.

• What about my child’s right to go through life without being judged on his parent’s beliefs?
• What about his right to go to go to any local preschool without needing to take part in worship or proving his parent’s commitment to a religion to gain a place?
• Why is time being taken away from the many other learning objectives these staff members have to worry about when this stuff could be taken care of by the parents at home?
• What about his right, and the right of all his future peers, to not give a hoot about what their parents believe about an afterlife and just get on with being kids?

I want my son to be educated, always at an age appropriate level, about the fact that people hold many different beliefs and they have the right to do so.

I want him eventually to understand the historical and cultural impact religion has had in shaping the society we live in.

I’m cool with him being in a nativity if emphasis is placed on the fact that this is a traditional story that some people believe and not taught as fact.

However, I’m not cool with being given the power by my government to decide what religion my child is. I can decide to label him as having some pretty hardcore beliefs, about whatever the hell I like, and in case they offend me the government will make sure these beliefs are incorporated into his education. (But they clarify that humanism is a philosophy rather than a religion, meaning that discriminating against the right to be taught their is no invisible spiritual leader is completely fine and dandy.)

Some of this I wanted to write on the form, or tell the manager in a mini rant as I handed back the papers. But I know it’s not her fault. It’s not the nursery – it is the higher powers in the education sector and the government forcing them to cover all bases. (Plus I don’t want my kid to be known as the one with a “difficult mother”).

I filled out the form as follows:

What religion is your child? As far as we know he is undecided.

I know in reality he’s most likely going to have a great time in this nursery and he’d probably have just as good a time in a Catholic nursery. It doesn’t really matter, but at the same time it does. This is step one where we put our kids into these categories. Step two is where we separate them out and keep them with their own kind and tell them what to believe.

Just let the kids play in the dirt together and enjoy learning about the world around them people. Toddlers don’t care about this stuff!

 

I haven’t joined a sect!!!

A pretty much lifelong feeling of confusion about my religious upbringing led me towards atheism. Then a couple of years ago I found Richard Dawkins, read The God Delusion and googled Humanism. Then I had that eureka moment – “YES!” – as I discovered that there was a name for what I believed in and, better yet, there are others out there who think the same.

That intense feeling was a pretty big moment I won’t ever forget. A huge part of it was relief that I wasn’t crazy, if I’m honest. At that point, a lot of areas of my life felt they would become a whole lot easier if I caved on all my feelings and just accepted that me and my little family were going to have to bow down to the pressures in our community to occasionally play ball with the church to get on in life.

A huge issue most people face when they leave a religion is the family and friends you don’t want to leave behind. I had no desire to distance myself from my christian friends (well apart from the real hardline, preachy times who were already long gone) or family. I had no issue with anybody in my life choosing to attend church themselves and I had no desire to try and “convert” more people to my way of thinking. It just wasn’t for me.

Shouldn’t be a problem then? Everyone can just believe what they like, surely? As it turned out, it wasn’t quite that easy. Making a decision not to attend Church (even at Christmas!), and thwarting any chance of my kids getting into a good church school made me a very bad parent in the eyes of my extended family. It was horrible enough in itself to have people close to me call into question whether or not I cared about my children’s futures, and then I realised that in some ways they’re probably right when you really start to think about our society.

I was also afraid to say anything to any of my old school friends in case they thought I was judging them. A few of them had started to plan their weddings and I thought they would think I was rolling my eyes during the ceremony and pretending to be happy for them. I love weddings and I get the romance of a church setting but it’s hard to explain to someone “I think it’s lovely and I fully support you if that’s what you want but I would feel like it was a waste-of-time sham if it was me stood up there saying things before God when everyone knows that me and Jesus haven’t had a heart-to-heart in quite some time.”

No matter how I think about expressing my views to my friends I just imagine that all they are hearing is me judging their life choices. It’s far easier, if it ever comes up, to just stick with “I’m not religious . . . but I think everyone can believe what they like”.

After a few weeks I plucked up the courage to attend a meetup through the British Humanist Association. On the day of the meeting I saw one of my really close friends for a coffee in the afternoon and casually dropped into conversation my plans for the evening. This is one of my most free-thinking, non-religious, easygoing friends and her instant reaction appeared to be one of concern and horror. She asked, “What are you going to? Are you joining something weird?!”

I was nervous enough about that coming evening and a little part of me still felt like I was doing something wrong and unnecessary by wanting to go, so I downplayed it and changed the conversation. My friend has never mentioned it since. It’s strange because the more I think about it the more I know that she is one of the few people in my life who does think the same things, the difference being that she doesn’t think there is an need to question it or worry about the impact religion has on society. As her parents are non-religious it has never really affected her life enough to see it as an issue, more a minor and rare annoyance.

On a separate note, the meeting was fantastic! It consolidated my positive feelings on humanism and washed away any niggling doubts I had that maybe I was signing up to some angry, religion-hating fanatical cult, open to exploitation in the same old ways. Tolerance, learning and debate are key ideals. All things which can often be restricted when you have to make sure you don’t go so far as to doubt the credibility of an ancient document.

My main gripe is not that people believe in a God for personal reasons, such as comfort, tradition, or just that that’s what they genuinely think is the truth. Some people don’t want to explain their opinions, or question things too much. I respect this.

But not when it affects my rights and my choice not to believe.

Not when my taxes pump extra funding into schools that my children have no access to because their parents don’t want to get up every Sunday and lie their asses off in Church.

Not when my children may be forced to participate in worship when they should be being educated (unless I single them out and get them removed into isolation during these times).

Not when buildings which should belong to the community for beneficial use of all ages are being run by people who require you to at least temporarily pretend you believe in it all to gain access to vital services.

Not when, for all the tolerance there is in the UK, I am still pretty much afraid of being totally socially excluded if I come out and tell people publicly that I am an atheist or a humanist.

You get the picture. I’m not the biggest fan of religion. And the church school thing in the UK bugs the hell out of me. But I promise you I am a really nice, tolerant person! If it did not affect my life negatively I would be far less narky about the whole thing.

As a family we moved six months ago to a new area due to my husband’s work and I would have to drive nearly an hour to get to the closest meetings through the British Humanist Association. Due to schedules, childcare and finances etc. it is just not feasible for me to go. There is absolutely nothing local relating to humanism or atheism ( I did decide to move to a small town with a church on every corner) and often as I make new friends I am thinking “Do you feel the same as me but keep quiet about it for the same reasons?”

If that one person lives in my town I have to find them!